1964 dot over 9

Post Reply
Piepala80
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:51 am

1964 dot over 9

Post by Piepala80 » Thu Feb 16, 2023 7:16 pm

Hello. Is the dot over 9 the rare one or the dot on 9 the rare variety
Attachments
6C923075-62FC-4971-A65E-F19208792F83.jpeg
6C923075-62FC-4971-A65E-F19208792F83.jpeg (520.82 KiB) Viewed 8334 times

Bill in Burl
Posts: 1470
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:41 am
Location: Golden Horseshoe, ONT

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by Bill in Burl » Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:17 pm

None are "rare" or even scarce or hard to find. It's a die chip or rust pit in the die, not a "dot" and essentially valueless.
And none of them are a "variety". A variety is something that was planned and put on the coin with approval by the mint, such as a design change. Keep it as an oddity that you found and keep it at that.
Bill in Burl

coinguy
Posts: 1344
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 10:03 am
Location: Golden Horseshoe Area

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by coinguy » Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:32 pm

Agree with everything Bill stated.
A die chip is a common occurrence and is part of the minting process.
I don’t know why they are referred to as a variety, someone calls it
rare or gives it a fancy name and all of a sudden it becomes a variety.

Piepala80
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:51 am

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by Piepala80 » Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:50 pm

This website has it listed a variety. It's a perfect dot. Doesn't look like a die chip.
Also this website has it valued about $1000. Coinguy and Bill is this website not publishing accurate information.
I actually follow Coins and Canada.com's price over Charlton. Realized sales are closer to this websites prices than Charlton. I also find that their variety information and photos very informative and accurate.
I'm asking which dot is scarcer because there are sellers that have mixed pricing when it comes to these two types.

troubadour
Posts: 385
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:46 pm

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by troubadour » Fri Feb 17, 2023 7:05 am

this website doesn't list only varieties but some errors too like Charlton
probably not $1,000 but it sells for hundreds
https://www.ebay.ca/sch/3389/i.html?_fr ... Complete=1

Bill in Burl
Posts: 1470
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:41 am
Location: Golden Horseshoe, ONT

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by Bill in Burl » Fri Feb 17, 2023 7:57 am

I'm not sure where you are getting prices and scracities/rarity information from, but it's not this site. The variety/error section of this site is a compilation of items sent into the site by just ordinary collectors submitting photos. The collectors themselves put their idea of a name on it. If somehow the site finds a price from a dealer or auction, they MAY list it as a price. But you don't know whether a newbie bought "words" instead of a coin will never be known. If you can show me any proof that your coin is worth (actually sell for)more than $100, I'll give you $20. The ones that I have seen on Ebay that actually "sold" never reached any of your figures and grossly below what the coin was listed at. They were all from the same dealer/vendor(Silver City Coin) and all were also cameo 65 or above, not like your coin. Five of the same coin and same grade in the course of 1 week from a single vendor should tell you something about rarity. They additionally had 7-8 of the same 1964 date with a "dot" ON the 9, so the company must have a plethora of 1964 MS coins waiting for newbies to bite. The the "cert'd" ones sold because of the "cameo" not any supposed dot. You can not take the "variety" section of this site as anything more than "Hey, this coin doesn't look like the picture", rather than realizing that, during the minting process, little minor discrepencies arise that are all well within tolerance and OK to put out, just like safety pins, or bobby pins or paper clips.
Bill in Burl

Piepala80
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:51 am

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by Piepala80 » Fri Feb 17, 2023 1:26 pm

Bill the pricing of any coin is based on auction sales, regular sales or demand. Last year the 1945 dollar and 1947 dollar prices and realized sale prices were high. I’ve seen them come down in price this year and the end of last year.
This website gives you pricing history on certain coins and you see the ups and downs. People who love error coins like myself would pay a premium. Obviously I won’t buy an error coin and there aren’t several similar that someone can classify it as a legitimate variety and not just a defect minting error.
Just like Swl or Arnprior dollars or double punched numbers these are errors that became varieties. The one I love is the 1858 10 cents 8 over 5. Extremely desirable or the 1872 50 cents v/a. Dumb errors that became varieties and extremely expensive.
I get you saying that people send in photos of slight errors on coins but those aren’t the coins I buy. If you look hard enough you will find them everywhere.

Bill in Burl
Posts: 1470
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:41 am
Location: Golden Horseshoe, ONT

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by Bill in Burl » Fri Feb 17, 2023 3:58 pm

I just know that anyone that uses this CaC site for pricing is in for huge disappointments. You get actually sales figures from EBay "sold" from their site and/or actual auction records and NOT from this site. You mention some recognized errors and varieties above, but this thread is about a die chip minor blip error on a 1964 penny and its rarity. As I showed you, there's a seller on Ebay who had or has sold 6 of them in the past 2 weeks(and I'm sure more to come), as well as more than a handful of his dots in a different place. One vendor with that many coins trying to sell them for a fortune bodes bad news for some newbie collectors.
Bill in Burl

troubadour
Posts: 385
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:46 pm

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by troubadour » Sat Feb 18, 2023 1:09 am

agree or disagree its offer and demand

feels like you are going too hard against the grain

letting people decide and time will make things right (or wrong)

some people are in love with "real/dies" varieties and some people are in love with errors as small as they are - who are we to judge what other people like and hoard

i wont pay for a $30,000 bored ape nft but some people did spend way more than that cause that's their thing. to me its worth $0 but the market decide how much it is really worth, not me and my personal beliefs (or yours)

and this site gives actual auction sales and you actually can compare retail and wholesale prices

Example of auction sales https://coinsandcanada.com/coins-auctio ... end=Search

if that vendor/seller is trying to sell a roll - piece by piece - of "dot" 1964 pennies, the prices will plummet faster than the next 2023 MS-66 circulating King Charles toonie

the market always adjusts itself but the reality right now is that this 1964 dot penny is selling for good money so why a price guide shouldn't mention it

User avatar
Gerryinthe6ix
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:45 am
Location: The place everyone loves to hate.
Contact:

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by Gerryinthe6ix » Sun Feb 19, 2023 8:28 am

I agree with Bill. The ‘dots’ are quite plentiful. I’ve actually tracked and photographed all kinds of variants. I would never imagine that folks would give me $100+ or more for them and then feel good about it. I have a couple of rolls. Now I am intrigued I will hold on to them. Imagine if I released one every few months. I could retire. Here’s an “Ultra Über Super-Duper Scarce Never Before Documented Double Dot Rarity” that seldom comes to market. It’s in extremely high demand. Selling price $250 each with credit approval. Limit FIVE per customer… <I’m kidding>.
Attachments
95648D63-F4A9-4F7C-B3A1-21E6F9C34744.jpeg
95648D63-F4A9-4F7C-B3A1-21E6F9C34744.jpeg (75 KiB) Viewed 8071 times

Bill in Burl
Posts: 1470
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:41 am
Location: Golden Horseshoe, ONT

Re: 1964 dot over 9

Post by Bill in Burl » Sun Feb 19, 2023 10:50 am

A very nice post, Gerry, and excellent photography on your new "dotted" coin. There used to be a member who would come up with "dot" coins of any number of dates and denominations on some coin sites, but haven't seen him in years. I'm sorry if I upset a few folks about being so terse about the '64 dot "rarity". I just don't like to see some folks get sucked in by "rarities" that are mentioned on these sites, when they are, in fact, quite common after even shallow research. Thanks for your post and with more than one foot on my side of the line.
Bill in Burl

Post Reply